Human : Bard 25 / Druid 5 / Shifter 10 (Helmed Horror)

[-firecracker-]

Race : Human
Classes : Bard 25 / Druid 5 / Shifter 10
Alignment : Chaotic Neutral


My example : Outsider


Ability scores
***********
STR : 8
DEX : 12
CON : 8
WIS : 18 [27]
INT : 12
CHA : 14 [16]


Level progression
**************
01    Bard [1]      Alertness, Weapon Proficiency Martial
02    Bard [2]
03    Bard [3]      Toughness
04    Bard [4]                  WIS+1 = 19
05    Bard [5]
06    Bard [6]       Curse Song
07    Bard [7]
08    Bard [8]                  WIS+1 = 20
09    Bard [9]       Blind Fight
10    Bard [10]
11    Bard [11]
12    Bard [12]       Extend Spell            WIS+1 = 21
13    Bard [13]
14    Bard [14]
15    Bard [15]      Weapon Focus Greatsword
16    Bard [16]                  WIS+1 = 22
17    Druid [1]
18    Druid [2]      Improved Critical Greatsword
19    Druid [3]
20    Druid [4]                  WIS+1 = 23
21    Druid [5]      Great Wisdom I = 24
22    Shifter [1]
23    Shifter [2]
24    Shifter [3]      Epic Prowess      WIS+1 = 25
25    Shifter [4]
26    Shifter [5]
27    Shifter [6]       Armor Skin
28    Shifter [7]                  WIS+1 = 26
29    Shifter [8]
30    Shifter [9]      Epic Weapon Focus Greatsword
31    Bard [17]
32    Bard [18]                  WIS+1 = 27
33    Shifter [10]    Construct Shape
34    Bard [19]
35    Bard [20]
36    Bard [21]       Lasting Inspiration      CHA+1 = 15
37    Bard [22]
38    Bard [23]      Epic Skill Focus Taunt*   
39    Bard [24]       Epic Skill Focus Perform
40    Bard [25]                  CHA+1 = 16

* = class bonus feat


Skill points
*********
Discipline : 43
Tumble : 40
Perform : 43
UMD : 32
Heal : 18
Spell Craft : 39
Taunt : 43


Misc Info
********
Use Helmed Horror shape.

AB with max STR, Bard Song and Bard War Cry spell is around 60.

AC with suggested gear, Haste and Bard Song is in the mid/high 60s.

You can get taunt into the 100s with this build (equip perform and taunt items for those really high concentration bosses) so has the ability to taunt just about anything in the mod.

[Spukky12]

Tried this build offline, I was rather annoyed by the inability to cast anything above 4th level bard spells due to the low base charisma until level 40, and even then only 6th level bard spells max, when you have the necessary bard levels to cast above that... is all the extra wisdom worth it?

[locmer]

Wisdom 27 is required for construct shape

[Khaine]

and even then only 6th level bard spells max, when you have the necessary bard levels to cast above that...

6th level is the highest lvl bard spell.

[Spukky12]

Wow really? I'm sorry then, I assumed it would go to 9th level spells like the other spellcasters i've tried. Hmm this game has a way of making me feel stupid   

[locmer]

Don't worry, it's a lot to swallow. I still have a hard time making builds "perfect", that's why talking about them either on this forum or in game has always been helpfull to me.

[Khaine]

Yeah, I often ask around for input from others as well when making new builds. Better to ask first than find out you wasted a good 4-7 days leveling a flawed toon.

[-firecracker-]

It is really tough trying any kind of shifter build in an offline mod because as soon as you shift you get no representation of how the build might be in the gvm mod as the shifter class has besically been rewriten for the better.

What would be cool is if the gvm mod had a sandbox room where any level 1 toon could enter and level up to 40 for free, include in the room a basic +5 equipment store too and gp well. The toon is flagged as a test toon when entering the sandbox somehow and on logout is automatically deleted from the server vault. Not sure how you would limit that to shifter toons though.

[klixon]

holy crap
++

[Khaine]

That may be one of the best suggestions I've seen in a very long time, fire. And I don't see any reason to limit it just to shifter toons, as most classes are rewritten, and although you can calculate those fairly easily, it'd still be cool to be able to simply test it on the server than on a local server.

[Khaine]

I've got a question regarding the build, as I recently came in posession of a good weapon to use on a shifter.

From what I've seen on the sign in the pocket, helmed horror shape has a fixed strength of 36 and con of 22, so that means base str and con doesn't matter, right? If so, I could sacrefice some base con and str in favour of 1 more wis, which would free up one epic feat for either epic weapon focus or armor skin (whichever isn't taken in the build), right?

Also, not related to the build, but more of an overall shifter question: does +damage vs alignment (like the +divine damage vs evil on eomer's spear) transfer to shapes, like regular +damage mods do? I'm a little reluctant to use the spear for a helmed horror build if the damage vs evil doesn't transfer, as the +magic damage on the spear won't stack with the +magic damage from the helmed horror shape, but if the damage vs evil transfers, then that'd be pretty sweet for a Gondor helmed horror toon.

EDIT: Oh, and while on the subject of what transfers to shapes from weapons -- does massive crits transfer?

[azurerogue]

It *should* transfer.  My +Enhancement vs alignments seems to transfer properly so +damage should as well.  I haven't tested for sure, though. 

[Khaine]

Hmm, ok. Guess I'll find out if I can get confirmation regarding the helmed horror stats (fixed str/con thingie).

[azurerogue]

Oh, that's true too (sorry, forgot to mention it).  The only reason you'd NEED higher than 8 in base stats would be for feat-related purposes (or to just make things easier before you get to your shape).

[-firecracker-]

Yep str and con are irrelavent once you have shifted to construct. I chose 10 strength so the toon doesnt always get encumbered when travelling around as it carrys a lot of gear (heal potions, +taunt & +perform items and a wide choice of weapons to switch out when doing something like BD). Same goes for con probably, gives the toon that much more hp when levelling and travelling.

Take both down to 8 and put widsom to 18, then you can take armour skin, epic prowess and epic weapon focus + one more, say epic perform

Mass crit should transfer, unless the shape already has it (like the death slaeed on one of its fists)

[Khaine]

Great, made my new helmed horror today, tho I've yet to start it because I don't really feel like solo leveling it, for obvious reasons. I'm also thinking of going for the 5 druid/9 shifter part pre epic, taking 1 lvl of bard when it's feat lvl for curse song, cos with 8 str and 8 con I figure it's easier to simply kill stuff while shapeshifted as soon as possible.

I can't really think of any reason why that wouldn't work, but then again I don't make a lot of shifter toons (actually, I never make them, simply because I have no way of testing the builds on a local server first). After spending 60 minutes 2manning certain bosses due to their insane AC and crit immunity, I'm really looking forward to having a good bard toon available.

[sestitodc]

Great, made my new helmed horror today, tho I've yet to start it because I don't really feel like solo leveling it, for obvious reasons. I'm also thinking of going for the 5 druid/9 shifter part pre epic, taking 1 lvl of bard when it's feat lvl for curse song, cos with 8 str and 8 con I figure it's easier to simply kill stuff while shapeshifted as soon as possible.

If you go Druid5/Shifter9/Bard6 pre epic, you'll lose 2 bab.

Also, one alteration I'd probably make is taking Lasting Inspiration at level 36, and epic skill focus taunt at 38. Bard's get access to epic skill focus as bonus feats, and imo, Lasting Inspiration two levels earlier is probably slightly nicer for leveling.

[Khaine]

Oh, didn't know that... Hmm, guess I'll just wait until someone I play with decides to make a hitter or sorc, and tag along the first 20 levels, then, and do it your way for the best BAB. :p

[azurerogue]

What faction is your helmed horror going to be?  I'm going to make a caster who should be able to plow through the first 20 levels pretty quickly (and who would love some help in later levels once you get good) soon.

[Khaine]

Gondor, for the +divine damage vs evil from Rohan's Glory. :3

[Thiagow2008]

does helmed horros changes ur alingment to w/e like undead shape?

btw i'll also start a Gondor sorc since my Mordor is 39 already.

[radagast]

Does undead shape change your alignment? Might not go down well with the rest of my fellow gonds if i go from lawful nuteral to evil 

[Sancho29]

I seem to remember the drow shape making you evil also?  Not sure,  I'd need a real shifter to confirm it.

[-firecracker-]

I don't think any of the construct shapes change your alignment.

[Endlessorrow]

I just checked on my test shifter and there are no alignment change shapes.