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Gondor vs Mordor  |  Gondor vs Mordor 1  |  GvM1 Players Forum  |  PVM in cities
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Author Topic: PVM in cities  (Read 11212 times)
charliebuckett
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« on: 06 September 2008, 23:36 »

Ok if you are killed by a guard and your team rezes you don't have to wait until the entire battle (or 10 mins) is over to resume correct? 
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ollebroc
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« Reply #1 on: 07 September 2008, 00:00 »

Not unless that NPC tells ya too.   Shocked
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Nobutadas
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« Reply #2 on: 07 September 2008, 00:44 »

There is more info to that that you failed to mention.  If you are in a pvp fight, and an npc gets the last shot, aka, you were running away or something, then, according to the rules posted at http://www.gondorvsmordor.com/gvm2/forum/index.php?topic=160.0  It states "If your engaged in a PvP battle and an NPC gets the final shot, you must still raise your opponent(except in the cities). PvP 10 minute rules will still apply, no instant killing to get the XP."  Correct me if I'm wrong. ^^

Edit: Can I get a dm to confirm this or refute this?
« Last Edit: 07 September 2008, 01:04 by Nobutadas » Logged

charliebuckett
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« Reply #3 on: 07 September 2008, 01:07 »

Hmm so one of my party rezed me with 1 hp I might add and I rejoined the battle (after resting)defending my party (which seems like a normal thing to do)...but thats not ok...but

porting into the louge and resting then rejoining the battle is ok?  Which you did three times..and is a frankly chicken crap thing to do.  You wanna rest...rest in the city. 
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Nobutadas
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« Reply #4 on: 07 September 2008, 01:16 »

If you have a complaint, please pm a dm in the forums. Or, if you asked me what happened, I would be happy to explain to you that the gondor people were hostile towards me, so, while you guys were dead, I ran off to aragorn, he killed me, I came through the portal, and then rested in the city.  Please have proof before accusing me of something.  And you could say that I was then in a pvp fight and let an npc kill me so I was out of battle, but there was no person attacking me, or who had recently attacked me who had not been killed, so there was no pvp battle going on while I was killed by an npc.  There fore, I was not running away by escaping through eru's portal, and I was not excluded from engaging in pvp.

Edit: I forgot to add that you were killed while in pvp, so when you were raised you ARNT allowed to initiate pvp for 10 min, but you just stated that you did, which is illegal.
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charliebuckett
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« Reply #5 on: 07 September 2008, 01:40 »

A. There wasn't a server shout on me.  (You had one three times that I saw from respawning or resting really doens't matter.)

B I was lying on the gound 10-15 mins until I could be rezed.  After I was another gondor Angel-Angels' archer (I think) attacked me while I was trying to heal and go rest.  So I guess I should just drop dead next time eh? 

C. So whats your point? 

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Whisper
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« Reply #6 on: 07 September 2008, 03:23 »

Is it not just kinda funny that the rules are still so broad, vague and muddled that after so many years we are still having these discussions?
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« Reply #7 on: 07 September 2008, 06:08 »

Not unless that NPC tells ya too.   Shocked

Wow, do I need to post the screenshots of you abusing me then and making me respawn when this exact same thing happened to me? I remember at that point you made some huge addition to the rules out of nowhere and then supposedly ammended the rules after it became apparent that you were abusing players...again.

So which is it? A npc kill counts as regular and you have to wait for 10 or no? Maybe you could stick with you answer this time and not flip flop back and forth as you see fit.
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pinkpuff
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« Reply #8 on: 07 September 2008, 06:10 »

Oh, and who was the genius that decided to put the no raise script into the cities?

Ever think that maybe your own faction would have to kill you due to stoning or something of that nature? Think its a lil stupid that your own faction can't raise you if they have to kill you?
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ollebroc
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« Reply #9 on: 07 September 2008, 06:43 »

There is more info to that that you failed to mention.  If you are in a pvp fight, and an npc gets the last shot, aka, you were running away or something, then, according to the rules posted at http://www.gondorvsmordor.com/gvm2/forum/index.php?topic=160.0  It states "If your engaged in a PvP battle and an NPC gets the final shot, you must still raise your opponent(except in the cities). PvP 10 minute rules will still apply, no instant killing to get the XP."  Correct me if I'm wrong. ^^

Edit: Can I get a dm to confirm this or refute this?


Yes, this is the rule.
Anywhere, except in the cities, an NPC steals your Kill, it still counts as if you did kill him. Wait your 10 minutes.

It is illegal to run thru the portal in the cities to rest, hide, or rebuff. If you did get killed by your own guards and respawned, you should probably not re-enter.

City Rules are simple, not much play in them.
  • NPC kills ya, you can respawn or wait for your teammate. There's no waiting time.
  • Player kills ya, must respawn.
  • You get stoned, there's more then 1-way to remedy that without having a teammate kill ya. Use your brains.

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« Reply #10 on: 07 September 2008, 15:51 »

Yes, this is the rule.
Anywhere, except in the cities, an NPC steals your Kill, it still counts as if you did kill him. Wait your 10 minutes.

It is illegal to run thru the portal in the cities to rest, hide, or rebuff. If you did get killed by your own guards and respawned, you should probably not re-enter.

City Rules are simple, not much play in them.
  • NPC kills ya, you can respawn or wait for your teammate. There's no waiting time.
  • Player kills ya, must respawn.
  • You get stoned, there's more then 1-way to remedy that without having a teammate kill ya. Use your brains.




Again, so which is it.
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ollebroc
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« Reply #11 on: 07 September 2008, 16:13 »

Which is what? Get the cotton ball out of your eyes.  Roll Eyes
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« Reply #12 on: 07 September 2008, 18:17 »

Hello,

     I can see where pink is kinda cinfused. You have 2 things saying if an NPC kills ya you can have

you rteammates rez ya, but if an NPC kills ya while in PvP you have to respawn. The 2 statements

kinda condradicts each other. The question now is who is to say how you died? with 2 view points

there will always be more than 1 right answer.

Thanks
Wake
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ollebroc
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« Reply #13 on: 07 September 2008, 20:20 »

Y'all seem to be over looking the key words which I highlighted "except in the cities, ". This is what differenciates the two statements.  Roll Eyes
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Rade
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« Reply #14 on: 07 September 2008, 20:21 »

Anywhere, except in the cities, an NPC steals your Kill, it still counts as if you did kill him. Wait your 10 minutes.

Now what really confuses me is who "you" is referring to. What I gather from this is that the PvP victor is "You" being that "an NPC steals your Kill, it still counts as if you did kill him" but then "Wait your 10 minutes" makes it seem like the victor must wait 10 minutes if outside of a city.

City Rules are simple, not much play in them.
  • NPC kills ya, you can respawn or wait for your teammate. There's no waiting time.
  • Player kills ya, must respawn.
  • You get stoned, there's more then 1-way to remedy that without having a teammate kill ya. Use your brains.

Now I think most of the confusion arises because the previous comment is "except in the cities" whereas the directly above is "City Rules".
So it seems to me like running to NPCs is desirable while in the city because that's the only time you can be raised by your teammate instead of respawning.
There are also rules on how to solve problems here too apparently; you can't do the typical stoned-kill-raise-heal tactic against your teammate which seems absolutely bogus to me because you should be able to interact with your team any way you want (without disrupting the aspect of "fun" from others; disruptive things like swearing or killing them just because).

What seems much simpler to me is that in Cities there should be a rule: the entire raiding party must be downed before anyone raiding must leave the city. Defenders cannot use the portal to exit combat (should be script enforced, i.e: if the last damager is a PC, Eru's portal does not transport them). Downed defenders must respect PvP rules as if it were anywhere else; they must leave the city (exception: not just the area they were killed in) after being raised for 10 minutes.
That way defenders have a really tough job on their hands, it encourages bigger parties for both defense and offense; and it's fairly clear if you ask me.

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Nobutadas, I believe charlie wasn't trying to single anyone out nor make a complaint; he was merely asking clarification on a rule. If -you- have a complaint to make against him, please contact a DM. Really the whole "he said she said" business is stupid; it doesn't get anyone anywhere and the circumstance is long over.
I sincerely doubt you or charlie lost anything but time, so there's really nothing that serious to complain about here - if you minded wasting time, you wouldn't be playing video games. Let's just bury the hatchet and try to get the city-rules clarified because there is obviously room for confusion depending on how people interpret the rules.

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« Reply #15 on: 07 September 2008, 21:31 »

Back when I was more active, I would have loved to come up with neat little diagrams depicting all the various scenarios and things like that.  They would have been little red and blue soldiers with arrows and circles and stuff, haha.  Oh what a headache rules were (are).
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Endlessorrow
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« Reply #16 on: 07 September 2008, 22:56 »

rofl   
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ollebroc
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« Reply #17 on: 08 September 2008, 01:15 »

We tried the raiding party must leave the city. It didn't work.

The rules posted in the rules section & Journal are better worded, but the 10 minutes replies to both that were fighting(loser and almost winner).

If ya came to a city un-equipped with Stone-to-Flesh scrolls, then thats your problem.
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pinkpuff
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« Reply #18 on: 08 September 2008, 01:30 »

We tried the raiding party must leave the city. It didn't work.

The rules posted in the rules section & Journal are better worded, but the 10 minutes replies to both that were fighting(loser and almost winner).

If ya came to a city un-equipped with Stone-to-Flesh scrolls, then thats your problem.

That wasn't there before so I would say its your problem.

Don't recall seeing that posted anywhere either.
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parknutz
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« Reply #19 on: 08 September 2008, 04:12 »

Do the starting cities sell stone to flesh scrolls?
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Snake
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« Reply #20 on: 08 September 2008, 05:41 »

*yawn* you guys were getting somewhere?
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Terrorble
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« Reply #21 on: 08 September 2008, 06:17 »

Headache for sure.  Time to iron this one out. 

I worked on rewording and making additions to the rules a while back and see now that some need work.  OFFICIAL RULES referenced by Nobutadas earlier are at http://www.gondorvsmordor.com/gvm2/forum/index.php?topic=160.0

I'd like to have the rules just right so that this kinda stuff is clear and everyone can have a great time.  Mostly they are this way.  Add in boiling tempers (mine included) and the rules become soggy noodles.  Watch for updates.
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« Reply #22 on: 08 September 2008, 17:16 »

And so where is the apology to the guy who SAID so in the battle? Dont bother- I know I wont be getting it.
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« Reply #23 on: 08 September 2008, 17:43 »

The guy who said what?

I recall you changing characters and coming back to attack every 3 minutes. You died a good 5-6 times and waited your 10 maybe once.
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Terrorble
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« Reply #24 on: 08 September 2008, 19:49 »

Without long explanations...

The easiest rule is to say if you are alive in a city, you are a legal target for defenders.  Even if you were JUST rez'd!!!  Basically if your teammates cannot cover you then you will die.  Works for both PvP and NPC related deaths.

Running from PvP thru a portal is essentially the same as logging out of PvP imo.  If it has been a few min with no apparent action is it fair to say the PvP is over and exiting thru the portal is acceptable.

For any defenders who die I think they should ALWAYS respawn.  With perma-DP it's the easiest/fastest/cleanest way.  They should be allowed to relog with any char they want as long as they respect the 10min rule.
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Do those rules cover it?

Complaints?

Alternatives?
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