Dragon Rant

[Kermit]

Once again- +6 weapons.
Why? CUZ YOU NERFED DRAGONS!!! No need to nerf dragons if EVERYONE has +6 weapons.
Or how about useless items being deleted? Muddy Boots comes to mind. CEP weapons comes to mind.
You are enlarging the Mod without decreasing the BS stuff. It will lag the hell out of GvM eventually rendering it unplayable.

Its already dying and you're thinking up more ways to speed is burial. Remember- I posted to you what Exaria did and I bet you NEVER find even one peron on it. People want a challenge but they also want a chance to win. They also want it to be a FAIR chance. Access. EQUAL access. And the only people that team up to go after Barad Dur and such are the ones who mostly play mords.

Want to make the REALLY uber stuff hard to get? Dont put it anywhere but in the cities. Screw making the rest of GvM forced team play. Its killing GvM. Along with the wipe that just wont happen soon enough for people to want to play and spend the time and effort being here.

Im not saying make everything easy but at least make the really tough and forced team play situation have to do with the cities and nowhere else. This makes it a bit tougher for Item hand outs as stated in other threads. It also makes the risk reward time spent on adventuring WORTH IT. Its nice to have new item ideas. But its even nicer to make it EQUALLY ACCESSABLE TO EVERYONE.

Not mad- just being loud so maybe some one will listen.

[Terrorble]

Damnit, could there be any possible reason for the muddy boots?  Do you just assume we want to frustrate players further by putting useless drops with no stats in the game?  We are aware of game resources.

Was there a reason +6 weapons were never put in?  I don't know.  Except there is one that I think drops, and I was about to add another.

I guess when it comes down to it, players want to play chars that are nearly invincible.  They can take their 90ac dragons with 1000hp and 69ab with +6claws, perma-ts, 6+ attacks/round with a couple at full ab bonus, hefty DR, sneak and mind immunity, and immunity to at least 1 elemental type, etc and rip everything to shreds.  Or take their Risen build anywhere be basically untouched.  Before that it was the PM-sorc/wiz farmer.

Kermit, the dragons lost some of their crazy +6/40 DR now +6/20.  You can still get 30/- against most everything with a single heavy armor.  We had multiple players suggest over the years that +6/40 was too much.  We had multiple players suggest that a big lizard shouldn't be able to hide/ms so well.  We gave them hide/ms penalties.  The latest change requires that dragons use actual AC gear to get their AC.  We've had many people complain about how dragons have top line ab AND ac.  Many good builds could do little to nothing against a dragon in PvP.  We get people wanting that aspect addressed.  We can always argue whether things were right or wrong, but not about whether there was basis for at least doing them.

Shins I don't know what to do to make you happy.   It's very likely that it lies a little out of my control so I don't take that personally at all.  IIRC you were one of the few with a dedicated shifter that would have benefited nicely from recent changes.

P.S.  Sorry Rade, I'm messing up the thread

[Kermit]

The muddy boots were thrown in for sarcasm- sorry.

My point on the dragons was that you are adding in a script that helps build toward bugs, lag and a general pain in the but to fix. Wouldn't it be easier to give +6 weapons? What Im saying is that in trying to improve on the mouse trap, you made it too big to fit under the sink. You're over thinking the problem. You write all these scripts to make things happen when the easy solution is right there.

And as far as items go, if you want certain items to be a pain to access, make them city drops and make the cities harder. Everything else should be soloable. A city run = "grab a 40 and lets do it". A run on something else... grab your 20... I dont have one... sorry.. maybe next time. Making them city drops would make building a LOT easier, makes Uber item placement a LOT easier and since there is going to be a flush out anyway, It gives you something to build toward. 

CLEARIFICATION_ I'm NOT advocating making Uber drops easier- Im advocating that uber drops be SOLEY inside the cities. The rest of the world should be almost soloable(you can solo it if you get good rolls) Take Eye Bozz ring and Beholder signet as an example- One better than the other. The better item drops in the cities. You can get the not quite uber item easily. And since the cities are being divided...

My motivation? I dont team up much. Risk/reward thing again. Why go thru the risk when you MIGHT get a drop and MIGHT win the roll? (shhh- explaining thoughts - I know the why) And this is another reason why Mordor is easier. Mords are mostly vets who are friends and are more apt to team up to take on Barad Dur, Galadriel, Balrog and the rest. If you are going to shoot for ballance, then you have to figure this in. All the really good stuff drops in the cities then every one is going to want to run a raid. More raids, more PvP.

I dont have the all the answers. Just some simple ones that take less effort, time and cause fewer problems. And Im sorry if I sounded insulting about the scripting. I actually admire you for doing it. It takes some thinking and testing and time to do, so never take what I say as an insult toward that.

And where is the cleaners in Gondor? I want to have my Muddy boots laundered. 

[charliebuckett]

The biggest change is in the AC.  That build went from a great tank (even if dispelled) to a salamander.

94 ac went to a decent 89. 

Kermit the vet excuse is getting old.  Hardly any old player are left that played mordor.  Tono BaaRam and Zad are as vet as you can get and only play Gondor.  Marcus and myself play mostly gondor.  I log mords recently only becuase there are no mords on to kill with a gondor.  Hell there is barely anyone on now... 

[Terrorble]

How would a +6 weapon help you as a rogue with 55ab at lvl40 against a dragon with 80+AC?  I don't mind the ideas but your fix just doesn't do anything.  If we had +6 weapons then who would drop those?  Hard bosses?  Well then you'd say you can't get them and complain about equal access.  There's a socialist leader somewhere looking for supporters I hear.  So we put the +6 weapons on regular mobs, and now players complain about how their +6/40 DR is pointless.  In some odd way we just NERFED dragons by putting in +6 weapons.  Not to mention that super rare Fury shield with +6/15 on it is now just a nice wall hanging back at the castle.

Nobody has mentioned that now for once you could make a non-monk dragon and actually have good AC.  No, I mean it would be taboo to think that with change there could be the possibility of a plus side.

[ShinsFortress]

Shins I don't know what to do to make you happy.   It's very likely that it lies a little out of my control so I don't take that personally at all.  IIRC you were one of the few with a dedicated shifter that would have benefited nicely from recent changes.

Correct to not take it directly personal!    I'm  and my wife says  .  While you could maybe influence a little some of what we (mostly me, not her) don't like, there is much that we are certain will not change at all.  We hope we have not been the root cause of any of the stress that this server has been through.  We're not throwing stones or anything, we're just stopping.

PS:  Thanks for remembering our dedicated Shifters; we had one each!

[Kermit]

How would a +6 weapon help you as a rogue with 55ab at lvl40 against a dragon with 80+AC?  I don't mind the ideas but your fix just doesn't do anything.  If we had +6 weapons then who would drop those?  Hard bosses?  Well then you'd say you can't get them and complain about equal access.  There's a socialist leader somewhere looking for supporters I hear.  So we put the +6 weapons on regular mobs, and now players complain about how their +6/40 DR is pointless.  In some odd way we just NERFED dragons by putting in +6 weapons.  Not to mention that super rare Fury shield with +6/15 on it is now just a nice wall hanging back at the castle.

Nobody has mentioned that now for once you could make a non-monk dragon and actually have good AC.  No, I mean it would be taboo to think that with change there could be the possibility of a plus side.

Im not slapping your scripting. You have done a great job. Look- the way a lot of things have changed, adding to the lack of people playing= they dont like the changes. I used Exaria as an example before and I'm going to again. There is never anyone on Exaria. Why is it even there? This was a bustin server since I started here. I even remember a couple of days it was full and I couldnt log in. /now.... 6-10 people.

The ideas are great and the scripting is brilliant.... but why do it if it kills the server? Look.... Im no wise man. And I could be wrong and the lack of people could be due to the coming wipe. Or... the idea that it could take months to get 1 uber drop or the idea that ya finally get the drop and its nerfed or ya finally get your uber farmer and it gets nerfed ..... Or all of the above.

Just dont be in a rush to make changes or add stuff before one thing gets worked out. What point is there to even playing if what you thought you knew today is going to change tomorrow and again the next week and again the next? FoN got nerfed... now nearly the same thing drops from the corsair captain. An uber scimi. So when is it going to be nerfed? Are ya starting to follow me? Things are changing too fast for them all to be accepted.

A single item shift can wipe out an entire build structure. A single nerf can wipe out an entire build structure. Now all of the time spent in the level up mod tweaking for the optimum build, the time spent building it and the time spent farming for the items required for it is totally wasted. Add Farm time for items+ lv up mod tweaking + actually building the toon= blood sweat and tears. You want any of that nerfed on your toon?

Several different issues here. I started talking about this quite a while back. I thought I could put it to bed. I really do want to. And to finallize- I think items can take the place of much scripting.

[Endlessorrow]

  Kermit I rarley agree whole heartedly with your opinions  but that last post struck me as very insightful and accurate except for the part about needing plus 6 weps  lol 

 I have a lot of frustration over some of the nerfs and changes that have happened making builds I worked on  more difficult to play.

 The tensers back down on attacks per round and discipline realy hurt 3 of my toons.

 The bioware undeaths eternal foe nerf hurt  sevral toons and combined with the loss of ability to craft scrolls easily and the weakining of tensers scrolls that was implemented made a very tough cleric sorc rdd I have become  low on ac. and no longer  the damage per round machine it was... I no longer play this toon for that reason.

 The adding of somatic components to some bard spells has proved irritating in the extreme, this too was a bioware gem.

[tonoplast]

hehe yup.

Perhaps before the changes are to be made, it should be outlined on the forum or something, so players will have a say about it. Tensers nerf was pretty sad.. and u dont see tensers around.. I had like 10+ tensers builds, lovely lvl 40 mules.. except 1 or 2! lol

Think before the barb buff, I was asking if it's gonna get nerfed just like how tensers were. and tada! it's nerfed.. I think it's quite important that the buff doesn't become OP. Needs to be thought carefully before introducing it, cuz nerf always causes a lot of complaints/unhappiness. It wouldn't be too bad if it was buffed but not to an extent.. but i guess the tenser's extra attacks were an accident..

Barb rage is pretty cool, tough it's still very buggy and not completely fixed, like the greater rage not giving 3 ab, but now we get -10 ac in total with terrifying (-6ac) and greater rage (-4ac). quite a nerf, i must say.. it's like we are being forced to make either barb pm or risen barb.. because of the aura lag, the +20 taunt goes up and down.. i wish the auras get fixed somehow.

Surprisingly ftr ring's standing strong! lol.. no -ac / ftr lvls after 20? or.. - displine / ftr lvl instead..

[pinkpuff]

hehe yup.
.. but i guess the tenser's extra attacks were an accident..

Nope, actually that version of tensers is exactly how it was supposed to be. The script we had here was a download, not a creative effort by a dev here. Same with the barb rages.

[Rade]

This really had nothing to do with the items thread, so I moved it. You'll notice a few items were removed; that was for the purpose of the Items thread, then I realized there was so much associated crap I might as well split it. Sorry if you lost yours, you can repost I'm sure.

I'd appreciate if someone could move this to a different section entirely.

[Kermit]

Rade- stop messing with the posts- you asked for items and I gave you an item and that was +6 weapons. This wasnt a dragon rant. This was a "STOP NERFING CRAP" rant if it was a rant at all.

Dont ask the question if you dont want an answer.

[Rade]

No.. no you don't get the point at all.
The other thread is to get an idea about what type of items you think are balanced and get ideas.

If you want +6 enhancement weapons; fine! Post a +6 weapon and include what other properties you think would be balanced on that item (i.e: Maybe if you're upping the hit chance and piercing ability, maybe you should lower the additional damage; I don't know, tell me what you think!)

This post, if you wanted to get the message across, could have stopped after the first line.
The rest of it has nothing to do with the post topic, much like the posts that get moved, deleted, edited, because they don't fit the format of MY SECTION.

I suggest you re-read the purpose of this section, the original post of any of my topics, and try to understand that this is MY idea breeding zone, and if you refuse to adhere to the FOCUS of discussions, expect your posts not to last very long.

This is about future, and like ManiacK brought up, it could very well be for nwn2 not just nwn1 - which is actually a likely case and I concede it wasn't obviously stated anywhere - so keep your issues with the CURRENT module in the discussion sections where someone will give a damn.


To say something about your post, just so that you know I'm still reading it:

You didn't necessarily bring up dragons, everyone else did.

I like your ideas of increasing drop frequency, because I agree that it's pretty BS at times. You not only have to be good and have no life, but you have to be lucky. Really it should be that: if you have the skills, you should get the reward..... most of the time. This discourages repetitive farming and focuses more on the task that makes playing fun: Challenge against others.

I'm TRYING to get the community's input on things, but its hard to control a mass of input without an iron fist; please try to understand why I have to sort through every post and keep threads directed. It leads to some people not wanting to post, but if they paid attention they could contribute happily.


PS: Please relax on the use of "you" directly because it can confuse readers. For example:

Why? CUZ YOU NERFED DRAGONS!!!

Because no, no I did not.

[charliebuckett]

This post, if you wanted to get the message across, could have stopped after the first line.
The rest of it has nothing to do with the post topic, much like the posts that get moved, deleted, edited, because they don't fit the format of MY SECTION.

This place is all about "MY" power anymore...

[Rade]

This place is all about "MY" power......... anymore???

Yeah Charlie, I guess it is... assuming you mean it is now about "MY" power....
It's pretty damn hard to get something done if you don't lay down the law once in a while; just look at the Canadian parliament, we've been a minority government for a number of years now and hardly anything has been done other than major things that pretty much everyone can agree upon.

It's not like I'm threatening anything either. I asked for this section so that I could focus discussion, and there's nothing wrong with taking away things that don't belong.
I can sympathize with your feeling of despair for bursting individual egos, but I don't think it's fair that you generalize me in this category because I'm trying to help and let you influence something; "my" power is being invested to give "you" power.

Of course, I assume you're generalizing it to me because you did take my quote and made the comment.... do you want to join me in moderating this section? I'm not being sarcastic either. Do you? Do you want to try to make sense of all these posts and leave the ones that seem like they're trying to tell you something relevant, but don't? Do you want to sift through all the "lol" posts and try to get an opinion from them? Please?

[ShinsFortress]

"focuses more on the task that makes playing fun: Challenge against others."

That assumes one cares more for PvP than PvE/M.  Just because player x plays on a PvP server doesn't mean they like PvP.  It could be that the setting/module/DM team are so good, that it's still better than the competition.

Of course, you could argue tough cheese to player x.  PvP server is full-on PvP server, not PvE/M with optional PvP.

[Kermit]

Charlie- TY for getting my point
Rade- I'm sorry I thought this was a power thing. And damn me for not getting it. I rant all day about the DMs not using their power- (DM player incident that was splayed all over the forum) I have stated in Tells I thought that the DM should have done a 3 day ban on all concerned(including myself) to show "this is the line- you crossed it. DONT do it again".

And then when Rade exhibited that by cutting the chaff from the item post and moving it to respective areas, I didnt get it. I'm so used to the maliable nature of the GVM staff that I went on a tyrade that my item idea(rant) was moved.

Rade- sorry. Good job.

[charliebuckett]

No Rade but thank you for asking.  Even if I wanted to I don't have that much time.  Thanks for clarifying your position on your area.  I'm not exactly sure why you feel the need to modify exsisting posts but its your area so do as you wish.  People gleen interesting information off things which have nothing to do with the original topic.  Who knows why ideas are generated off other ideas, but it happens.  People blow off steam at this site...if they didn't they wouldn't play here.  Be worried when they don't.

I don't know if anyone else notices but when the posts stop the playing stops too.

[Rade]

Locking this topic now, starting a new one. I don't see anything useful stemming from this anymore.

If you have anymore problems with this or any other matter involving my section, please send me a Private Message so that we can deal with it between the two of us and not clutter these threads.