DD Build

[parknutz]

So trying to kick around a DD build that can be somewhat of a tank. This one doesn't have UMD which is major draw back. This toon should level with a party cleric/wiz since he wont have Haste and other buff spells. This build has a base DR of 18 and Epic Dodge. ED you can get earlier than 39th but I wanted to max Tumble. I suppose you can make this a parry build and have enough attack per round to parry a raged barbarian.


Dwarf 9Monk/5SD/26DD
18DEX,16WIS,13INT the only starting stats that matter
1) Monk Dodge
2) Monk
3) Monk Wpn Finesse
4) Monk DEX(19)
5) Monk
6) Monk Mobility
7) Monk Hide, MS, Tumble
SD Dex (20)
9) SD Toughness
10) SD
11) DD
12) DD Wpn focus kama  Dex(21)
13) DD
14) DD
15) DD Expertise
16) DD (DEX 22)
17) DD
18) DD Improved Expertise
19) DD
20) DD DEX(23)
21) DD Great Dex I (24)
22) SD
23) SD
24) DD Great DEX II(25), DEX(26)
25) DD
26) DD* Epic wpn focus kama
27) DD Great DEX III(27)
28) DD DEX(28)
29) DD
30) DD *epic prowess, armor skin
31) DD
32) Monk WIS(17)
33) DD Epic Energy Resistance(your choice)
34) DD
35) DD *Epic Energy Resistance (your choice)
36) DD Blinding Speed WIS(18)
37) Monk max tumble
38) DD
39) DD Epic Dodge
40) DD *where you want to put last STAT increase* Epic Energy Resistance

If traveling with a party should be an OK tank. Haste and bard song would help him out tremendously.
Definitely need DEX and WIS gear but not necessary if you travel with some casters. Fully buffed AC should be near 77 i think. 87with Improved Expertise or 81 in defensive stance.

Should you get hit you soak the first 18 damage plus any other resistance you may have. With the DD levels you will regen HP at an ok rate.
AB isn't that great but you aren't there to take down enemies now are you?

Saving Throws should be pretty good with evasion.

Rip through it. Tell me what you think? KK, you see this?

[MasterThief]

Ive been experimenting with a DD 22 Rogue 16 SD 2 which is coming along nicely, i also had success with a fighter version but, with the hips timer, having tons of hps and dr helps make it better than the fighter version.

I am finding that building str based sd's with the equipment available is quite effective and its not hard to get a decent ms and hide, against npcs at least 

I would suggest dropping 4 lvls of DD and taking 13 monk - for the loss of 3 dr you get 22 SR which might help and (i havent got my book at work  ) a couple more monk type free feats i believe and a ki strike +1 as well.

You would also be able to max your tumble etc a couple more times and get epic dodge alot earlier this way 

I also noticed you took kama and no twf skills i know there is a magic kama with those abilites on it but i still prefer the glove option, 2d10 or 2d12 takes some beating and there seems to be more slashing/piercing res than bludgeoning, good for those pesky undead, in saying that i suppose using both is an option 

Apart from that looks good, i would go with endless suggestions below they make sense

[Endlessorrow]

I Like the idea   only thing I would do differently maybey is start wis at 14 and leave it then go 14 int and 15 con. then leave wis alone while leveling focusing on dex only neting 2 more ab and picking up listen skill...   I prefer listen to spot for pvp purposes but go spot for monsters. 
 
  With defensive awareness and such high ac and epicdodge along with the dr I think you would tank like crazy with this build without the improved expertise. I would consider dumping it for blind fight or improved crit. to help out with your offense a bit more.

[parknutz]

Thanks for your opinions. 

[Terrorble]

I don't think the parry skill allows you to parry more than 3 attacks per round no matter how many you have.  I haven't checked this in years tho, has it changed?  Be nice if it did.

[parknutz]

You're right Terror no more than 3 attacks a round but with this build the first attack will always miss.

[charliebuckett]

Just curious so would that be ED then parry parry parry?  Wow

[pinkpuff]

Epic dodge First attack
Parry 2nd
Parry 3rd
4th attack would have a chance of hitting
Parry 5th

Assuming you are fighting something with 5 attacks.

[deathdude]

Epic dodge First attack
Parry 2nd
Parry 3rd
4th attack would have a chance of hitting
Parry 5th

Assuming you are fighting something with 5 attacks.

would concealment from say imp invis count towards that too? say if they missed because of concealment would that use up one of the parry uses or not?

[NLawson]

It wouldn't use up one of the parry uses. Riposte attacks however do...so if you parry and riposte that's one parry left for the whole round.

For example...say you have 9 attacks per round, opponent has 9 also (3 flurries of 3 attacks). Lets also assume this build successfully parries as many attacks as possible, and gets no ripostes. Parry only tries to block the first attack in every flurry, and since this build has epic dodge - the first attack in the first flurry is always covered.
(Flurry 1)
Attack 1 - Possible hit (The first possible hit that connects becomes epic dodge)
Attack 2 - Possible hit
Attack 3 - Possible hit
(Flurry 2)
Attack 4 - Parry
Attack 5 - Possible hit
Attack 6 - Possible hit
(Flurry 3)
Attack 7 - Parry
Attack 8 - Possible hit
Attack 9 - Possible hit

The possible hits that actually hit, other than the first one to connect, are still vulnerable to missing because of concealment. Parry will only try to block the first attack in each flurry, and so even with epic dodge there are only 2 parries, though this does free up a possible riposte.

[parknutz]

Ahh so you made a parry build on GvM?

[NLawson]

No I can't say I have - going by what parry is typically programmed to do, I wouldn't waste my time. If it hasn't been changed, then my post is completely correct. However, you wouldn't have bothered posting something so pointless if there hadn't been some change to parry that you're anxious to brag about, so just let me know what it is and I'll fix my post.

[pinkpuff]

would concealment from say imp invis count towards that too? say if they missed because of concealment would that use up one of the parry uses or not?

Conceal gives you a chance to evade the attack before any real rolls are made, but you would still be limited to one parry per round segment.

For those that don't know the 2 best tanks on the server are 21bard/3rogue/16pm that gets 100+ac and Warding and a 20bard10sd10pm that gets 90ish ac, Epic Dodge, and probably about 80 parry with current items that I have seen.

[nwnolan]

For the 21 Bard, 3 Rogue 16 PM, is the Rogue just for Evasion?

[deathdude]

probably, and its a dex based build right??? your not gonna be able to kill anything on your own

[Khaine]

Can get 100+ AC and epic dodge with 14 bard/16pm/10 sd... Albeit short song duration.
And yeah, they're dex builds. No way you can reach 100+ AC with a str build with only 16 PM levels, and epic dodge requires high dex.
If you get another bard in your party, then 4 bard/26 pm/10 sd might be the best tank, with probably 110+ ac with song, and epic dodge.

On a sidenote, you can reach ~86-87 ac without song with a strength build (got 92 ac on my antagonist with epic warding, while partying with a bard and not raging). Unless they remove whirlwind attack from balrog, however, I see no reason to bother making a dedicated tank build, since balrog doesn't really need a tank, and no other bosses can really hurt 92 ac.

[pinkpuff]

3 rogue for Uncanny Dodge.

Having a single toon that can tank, curse, and taunt is invaluable. All you need is 2 damagers and maybe a healer to make a 4 person party capable of anything.